{"id":47031,"date":"2013-12-23T10:00:35","date_gmt":"2013-12-23T15:00:35","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.theparisreview.org\/blog\/?p=47031"},"modified":"2013-12-23T09:38:07","modified_gmt":"2013-12-23T14:38:07","slug":"gchatting-with-george-saunders","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.theparisreview.org\/blog\/2013\/12\/23\/gchatting-with-george-saunders\/","title":{"rendered":"Gchatting with George Saunders"},"content":{"rendered":"

\"SAUNDERS_large\"<\/a>
\nAll this week, we are bringing you some of your favorite posts from 2013. Happy holidays!<\/em><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

On Valentine\u2019s Day, George Saunders agreed to Gchat with <\/em>The Paris Review Daily to discuss his use of the modern vernacular in fiction; his new book, <\/em>Tenth of December<\/a>; as well as Nicki Minaj and what is, according to Saunders, one of the great undernarrrated pleasures of living.<\/em><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

George:<\/b> Hi Katherine – ready on this end when you are<\/p>\n

me:<\/strong> Hi George!
I am prepared<\/p>\n

George:<\/strong> Well, I\u2019m not sure I am. But I am willing. \ud83d\ude42<\/p>\n

me:<\/strong>\u00a0we could just do the whole thing as emoticons<\/p>\n

:\/ :l \ud83d\ude15<\/p>\n

George:<\/strong> Man, you are a virtuosiii of emoticons.<\/p>\n

me:<\/strong>\u00a0A symptom of my generation…<\/p>\n

George:<\/strong> I only know that one.<\/p>\n

me:<\/strong> You only know happiness, then.<\/p>\n

George:<\/strong> No – I only know the SYMBOL for happiness. Like, I can\u2019t do ENNUI. <\/p>\n

me:<\/strong> Well, in this space the symbol and emotion are one.<\/p>\n

George:<\/strong>\u00a0\ud83d\ude42<\/p>\n

me:<\/strong>\u00a0So I thought this would be a good format in which to discuss your use of modern vernacular in fiction<\/p>\n

George:<\/strong>\u00a0Sure. \u00a0A perfect format for that, I\u2019d say…<\/p>\n

me:<\/strong> and also free and direct discourse – since gchat has that flow in real time
so if that sounds fun let’s get into it?<\/p>\n

George:<\/strong> Let
Let
Let
Let\u2019s do it, I meant to say. I was \u201cg-stuttering\u201d there…<\/p>\n

me:<\/strong> Ain\u2019t nuthin\u2019 but a g thang…
My questions are written out formally which should be a nice contrast to my otherwise bad capitalization and punctuation
And quoting Snoop Dogg<\/p>\n

George:<\/strong> And I shall answer them with aplomb, dear lady, forthwith.<\/p>\n

me:<\/strong> So, you\u2019re able to both relish and lampoon modern vernacular – the \u201cso, likes\u201d and \u201ci doubt its\u2019 that pop throughout your fiction. How did this balance of celebration and satire develop? \u00a0<\/p>\n

George:<\/strong> When I was starting out I had some basic tightassedness re literary diction – thought that \u201creal\u201d literature had to occur in a space slightly higher than you could actually enact in real-time. This had its origins in the fact that I didn\u2019t know any writers etc etc.\u00a0So it was a breakthrough (hardwon, late in coming) when I realized that there is really no difference between high and low speech – they both \u201cindicate,\u201d they both scan, they both give off energy when read.\u00a0So that was a great thing, to suddenly be able to consider ALL language as possible candidates for what we might call \u201cpoetic elevation\u201d – that process of compression\/exclusion that takes a diction and kicks it up into (hopefully) a kind of super-expressive purity….<\/p>\n

me:<\/strong> (omg so much aplomb!)<\/p>\n

George:<\/strong> Suddenly you could literally \u201chear American singing\u201d – just as it was. Whatever you heard was de facto a candidate for inclusion in fiction.
Yes, I have an excess of aplomb today.<\/p>\n

me:<\/strong> In your new collection a lot of the vernacular you select feels so specific to \u201cnow\u201d – how do you make these choices when speech patterns and memes are shifting so quickly? Is there a standard of durability?<\/p>\n

George:<\/strong> Honestly – and this is where things get gauzy – so much of that process is intuitive. Just deciding minute-by-minute, over and over again, over the period during which you\u2019re writing the story. Sort of like seasoning to taste or something like that. I think that\u2019s one of the maybe under-discussed aspects of process – the difference between a good writing day and a bad one is the quality of the split-second decisions you made. And that is dependent upon – well, who knows? So, for example, you might put in some little nugget that seems\/feels current – and then, four months later, re-reading it, it feels \u201ctoo\u201d current – then out it comes. But I can honestly say that whenever I feel myself formulating or invoking something that is conceptual\/theoretical (ala \u201cmy policy on brand-names\u201d) I veer away from that so fast. I just know from experience that my instincts are better than my cerebration.
Cerebrate good times, come on!
Sent at 11:08 AM on Thursday<\/p>\n

[GEORGE GOES GRAY]<\/p>\n

me:<\/strong> Are you gone or just invisible?
Oh, it seems you are invisible…
In that case: where do you pick up most of the argot you appropriate from pop culture?<\/p>\n

George:<\/strong> Sorry – my battery died and I had to race frantically down the hall for the cord. Am back. And winded.<\/p>\n

me:<\/strong> Always a joy to be so lucid online and then have to run down the hall and be reminded of one\u2019s corporeality.<\/p>\n

George:<\/strong> I think I just pick it up by osmosis, you know? Have always been a pretty happy TV watcher and so on. Plus it\u2019s interesting to me. Maybe the way it works is that if a person is sort of a language-wonk, bits of language (overheard etc) \u201csticks\u201d to that person a little more aggressively. Like – I\u2019m not sure how obscene I am allowed to be on here, but I\u2019ll assume totally…A few yrs ago I got a sort of anti-fan letter that said I was \u201ccocksuckworthian.\u201d\u00a0That word has stayed with me. As…well, as I guess it would. And yes – corporeal for sure. And through it all, our two dogs were here in the room, sleeping through the crisis.<\/p>\n

me:<\/strong>\u00a0What are some of the most inspiring television shows to you?
and: hi dogs!
hi guys!<\/p>\n

George:<\/strong> Well, we live out in the country now, so we don\u2019t have \u201creal\u201d TV or cable. So what we watch is on DVD But I pretty much (when on the road, say) just whatever happens to come on. Like the other day I watched that show re Nicki Minaj\u2019s tour. Whatever. It\u2019s all input.
And every- and anything can tell you something essential about the species.\u00a0Even if it\u2019s only by observing the falseness of the frame, if you will – the internalized distortions the particular program has taken on etc etc.<\/p>\n

me:<\/strong> Speaking of distortions, Nicki is a judge on American Idol at the moment
and she frequently takes on this british accent and becomes a different character – I think psychologically to make crushing people\u2019s dreams easier on her psyche.
She\u2019ll be like: \u201cI\u2019m so sorry dahling but we just cahn\u2019t do it today\u201d<\/p>\n

George:<\/strong> I do that myself, all the time. Like at the grocery store: \u201cDear lad, this pepperoni rather bloody appears to be past its expiration date. And that lady appears to be going into labour.\u201d<\/p>\n

me:<\/strong>\u00a0\u201cSir, if you could just not put the blasted eggs at the bottoum of the bag…\u201d<\/p>\n

George: <\/strong>I find it exciting to think that whatever language the culture produces can be grist for the literary mill – well, and that it would HAVE to be, you know? And that goes for extra-linguistic things too – whatever thought patterns are manifesting out there, have to be interesting to us as writers. Part of \u201cgrowing\u201d ourselves as writers (there…there\u2019s a mod usage there) is to keep expanding our vision of \u201cwhat is art\u201d outward to accommodate whatever is…out there, in reality.<\/p>\n

me:<\/strong> Do you have a phrase you really like in this moment?
Something you heard recently and felt YES?<\/p>\n

George:<\/strong> Nothing\u2019s coming to mind. I\u2019m still feeling the pain of \u201ccocksuckworthian.\u201d
Funny thing – I think g-chat is a little…Catholic. It always says \u201ckatherinebernard is busy. You may be interrupting.\u201d It\u2019s like it has an auto-nun feature.<\/p>\n

me:<\/strong>\u00a0 I\u2019m soooo busyyyyyy<\/p>\n

get in linnnne George!
Since it\u2019s Valentine\u2019s day may I tell you a love-and-Saunders story?
are you ok on time?<\/p>\n

George:<\/strong> Sure – and it\u2019s ok with me if we go a bit past the time allotted, btw.<\/p>\n

me:<\/strong> A friend of mine once expressed doubts about a potential suitor because he was unable to grasp Saunders Capitalization in e-mails.
It turned out to be a red flag for cultural miscommunication.<\/p>\n

George:<\/strong> Eeek, though. I\u2019d be careful with that. It can become An Obnoxious Thing. As was once pointed out to me in a Stinging Review. After which I stopped Doing It.<\/p>\n

me:\u00a0<\/strong>I will let her know.
I am still a Fan.<\/p>\n

George:<\/strong> I mean –
I mean – you
You\u2019d hate to exclude a Worthy Suitor.
Nice typing there. That\u2019s what I get for trying to g-chat while making an omelet and changing my piston rings and writing a short memoir.<\/p>\n

me:<\/strong> Turns out in the end he was Unworthy in Every Way<\/p>\n

George: <\/strong>So many are. These dudes today. And always.
Such as me, circa 1986.<\/p>\n

me:<\/strong> What about circa 2013?<\/p>\n

George:<\/strong> My wife and I have been married 25 years so we are just going out to lunch, very happily – I\u2019ve been out of town for awhile and it\u2019s just nice being together.<\/p>\n

George:<\/strong> One of the great under-narrrated pleasures of living: long-term fidelity & love.<\/p>\n

me:<\/strong> That\u2019s so lovely!
Happy valentines day to her!<\/p>\n

George:<\/strong> And happy valentie
Happy valentine\u2019s to you too.
Someone rigged this computer up with a secret \u201csend-before-done\u201d button.<\/p>\n

me:<\/strong> That was me actually
I wanted to get the whole truth you know…<\/p>\n

George:<\/strong> Good luck with that. A worthy ambition for life, however.<\/p>\n

me:<\/strong> Do I still have time for one more question?<\/p>\n

George:<\/strong> Sure.<\/p>\n

me:<\/strong> Um, so, many office workers spend a lot of their days streaming here on gchat, producing these casual literary documents.
What effect do you think the Everyman\u2019s growing comfort with articulating his thoughts and feelings in a written format, and absorbing the thoughts and feelings of others from written language, might have on literary culture over the next decade?<\/p>\n

George:<\/strong> I\u2019m not sure. The one sort of obvious thing is that there\u2019s a big gulf between all of those thousands of in-the-moment typing bursts and what I would consider \u201cthe literary\u201d – and that is revision. For me, that process of taking a first draft and working with it over a period of months is EVERYTHING. That\u2019s where a person finds out what he really means and (you could argue) who he really IS. So I suppose one danger is that we might get the idea that, you know, \u201cto blurt, is to be.\u201d The idea that whatever comes out is good and is us.\u00a0Whereas someone who has really worked with text realizes – well, that neither one is \u201creally\u201d you, but that the considered version might represent a \u201chigher\u201d you – brighter, less willing to coast or condescend, funnier, and (mysteriously) also, I think, kinder.<\/p>\n

George:<\/strong> Not to say, btw, that some spontaneous text isn\u2019t brilliant – but in my experience, you can also do the sort of revision where you are trying to sort through and link up a series of good spontaneous moments.<\/p>\n

me:<\/strong> (The commenters on this post can keep in mind that kinder part.)<\/p>\n

George:<\/strong> As should we all.<\/p>\n

me:<\/strong> Well, thank you so much for taking the time to type to me<\/p>\n

George:<\/strong> I\u2019ve really enjoyed it, Katherine – thanks so much.<\/p>\n

me:<\/strong> This has been awesome and amazing.<\/p>\n

George:<\/strong> My pleasure – hope we meet in person someday.<\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

All this week, we are bringing you some of your favorite posts from 2013. Happy holidays! On Valentine\u2019s Day, George Saunders agreed to Gchat with The Paris Review Daily to discuss his use of the modern vernacular in fiction; his new book, Tenth of December; as well as Nicki Minaj and what is, according to […]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":368,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"footnotes":""},"categories":[907],"tags":[20541,10108,970,10109,2111,10107,224,75],"class_list":["post-47031","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-at-work","tag-at-work","tag-gchat","tag-george-saunders","tag-google-chat","tag-love","tag-on-writing","tag-technology","tag-writing"],"acf":[],"yoast_head":"\nGchatting with George Saunders by Katherine Bernard<\/title>\n<meta name=\"description\" content=\"December 23, 2013 \u2013 All this week, we are bringing you some of your favorite posts from 2013. Happy holidays! 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